I just read from another blog that I am subscribed to a very interesting post. The http://www.blogger.com/img/gl.link.gifquestion has to do with Mission Agencies and Field Councils. It also has to do with the amount of input that comes from the local church. It is trying to see what happens in terms of the Bible and not common practice.
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Tuesday, October 23, 2007
Saturday, October 20, 2007
Closed country discussion
I received the following question some time ago and just have been covered up and unable to answer this. I will leave this here and hope that some of you give your opinions. I am really very busy getting ready for tomorrow right now and may not give my comments until Monday but this is a discussion that really needs to be thought through. Comment and be a blessing to your brother!
Say a missionary goes to learn the language of a "closed" country and then
before getting much accomplished gets kicked out of the country. Was the
risk worth it, time, and money worth it? Or is it a waste of the churches
money to send missionaries where missionaries aren't welcome. Maybe it's a
loaded question but I think about as we have moved two families into a
Muslim country and are planning on moving many more.
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Say a missionary goes to learn the language of a "closed" country and then
before getting much accomplished gets kicked out of the country. Was the
risk worth it, time, and money worth it? Or is it a waste of the churches
money to send missionaries where missionaries aren't welcome. Maybe it's a
loaded question but I think about as we have moved two families into a
Muslim country and are planning on moving many more.
Vision News
If
If you can trust when everyone about you Is doubting Him, proclaiming Him untrue;
If you can hope in Christ, tho' all forsake you And say 'tis not the thing for you to do;
If you can wait on God, nor wish to hurry, Or, being greatly used, keep humble still;
Or If you're tested, still refuse to worry, And so remain within His sovereign will;
If you can say, 'tis well, when sorrow greets you, And death has taken those you hold most dear;
if you can smile when adverse trials meet you, And be content e'en tho' your lot be drear;
If you can be reviled and never murmur, Or being tempted, not give way to sin;
If you fight for right and stand the firmer, Or lose the battle when you ought to win---
If you can really long for His appearing, And therefore set your heart on things above;
If you can speak for Christ in spite of sneering, Or to the most unlovely one show love;
If you can hear the call of God to labour, And answer, "Yes" in yieldness and trust, And go to tell the story of the Saviour To souls in darkness o'er the desert dust;
If you can pray when Satan's darts are strongest, And take the road of faith instead of sight; Or walk with God, e'en tho' His way be longest, And swerve not to the left nor to the right;
If you desire Himself alone to fill you, For Him alone you care to live and be;
Then 'tis not you, but CHRIST Who dwelleth in And that, 0 child of God, Is victory!
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If you can hope in Christ, tho' all forsake you And say 'tis not the thing for you to do;
If you can wait on God, nor wish to hurry, Or, being greatly used, keep humble still;
Or If you're tested, still refuse to worry, And so remain within His sovereign will;
If you can say, 'tis well, when sorrow greets you, And death has taken those you hold most dear;
if you can smile when adverse trials meet you, And be content e'en tho' your lot be drear;
If you can be reviled and never murmur, Or being tempted, not give way to sin;
If you fight for right and stand the firmer, Or lose the battle when you ought to win---
If you can really long for His appearing, And therefore set your heart on things above;
If you can speak for Christ in spite of sneering, Or to the most unlovely one show love;
If you can hear the call of God to labour, And answer, "Yes" in yieldness and trust, And go to tell the story of the Saviour To souls in darkness o'er the desert dust;
If you can pray when Satan's darts are strongest, And take the road of faith instead of sight; Or walk with God, e'en tho' His way be longest, And swerve not to the left nor to the right;
If you desire Himself alone to fill you, For Him alone you care to live and be;
Then 'tis not you, but CHRIST Who dwelleth in And that, 0 child of God, Is victory!
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Thursday, October 18, 2007
How many meetings?
I got the following in an email but thought it would be good if we could get all of you to give opinions on the question. No rudeness allowed. Just click on comment and begin commenting. I will do the same. These are questions that we are faced with and should get an answer to:
it says "And daily in the temple, and in every house,
they ceased not to teach and preach Jesus Christ."
I was wondering did they do this daily because;
1. it was tradition to be in the temple daily
2. were they meeting in certain houses every day,or
3. meeting every day, but in different houses
4. did they do it every day because of transportation for example, cell type meetings for each area so that everyone could at least have a meeting once a week?
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it says "And daily in the temple, and in every house,
they ceased not to teach and preach Jesus Christ."
I was wondering did they do this daily because;
1. it was tradition to be in the temple daily
2. were they meeting in certain houses every day,or
3. meeting every day, but in different houses
4. did they do it every day because of transportation for example, cell type meetings for each area so that everyone could at least have a meeting once a week?
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Tuesday, October 16, 2007
The ball is in your court
Now we have been going through this for days. You might think that the person you are dealing with will never do so much. I have found over the years that they will if they truly love God and want to do right. They will especially do it if you love them and they are sure that you are doing it all for their best and their good. They want to know if you love them and really believe in them.
Now what do you do if the person is not willing to follow through? Well what I do is explain to them the phrase, the ball is in your court! That means that I love you and I want to help you. I came to you. Now I will help you and continue helping you if you really want help to serve and honor God.
I tell them that they can be stronger than ever if they allow God to take this failure and turn it into a victory. I tell them that I will be there for them but they must do their part. I explain that I can not make them do right. It has to first be a work of God in their heart and secondly something that they truly want.
I will go after them over and over until they reject me but if they refuse to follow through on the discipline then that means that I did not throw them out but that they threw themselves out.
The ball is in your court. Will you respond and do what God wants you to do?
I meet with them time and time again. Actually after their sin we may be closer to each other than we have ever been before.
Are you willing to love them when they do not deserve to be loved? Are you willing to go after the lost sheep and bring them back to the fold?
I am more than willing to try and answer your questions if you will just write me.
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Now what do you do if the person is not willing to follow through? Well what I do is explain to them the phrase, the ball is in your court! That means that I love you and I want to help you. I came to you. Now I will help you and continue helping you if you really want help to serve and honor God.
I tell them that they can be stronger than ever if they allow God to take this failure and turn it into a victory. I tell them that I will be there for them but they must do their part. I explain that I can not make them do right. It has to first be a work of God in their heart and secondly something that they truly want.
I will go after them over and over until they reject me but if they refuse to follow through on the discipline then that means that I did not throw them out but that they threw themselves out.
The ball is in your court. Will you respond and do what God wants you to do?
I meet with them time and time again. Actually after their sin we may be closer to each other than we have ever been before.
Are you willing to love them when they do not deserve to be loved? Are you willing to go after the lost sheep and bring them back to the fold?
I am more than willing to try and answer your questions if you will just write me.
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Monday, October 15, 2007
Passages to renew our minds
Here is a list of passages that I feel are simply essential to help someone that has fallen. Do not be legalistic about it but help them through the process. I will explain in another post what to do if someone refuses to follow these steps.
James 1:21--the basis for the whole process
Romans 12:2 another base verse
Philippians 4:8 Control your thoughts
Romans 5:20 No matter how much I fail him he has more grace than I have sin
Psalms 32--David confesses his sin under inspiration of the Spirit and so we know this is a good passage to learn the heart of a forgiven one when he confesses.
Psalms 51 is the most obvious passage
Romans 6, 7, 8 this will take a long time but that is fine. As long as their heart and mind is consumed with the Scripture they will not be going back to sin. I think it was D L Moody that said that sin will keep you from the book or the book will keep you from sin.
Ephesians 4:17-31 Tells you what to replace your sin with
Colossians 3:1:17 Tells you how to live the new life you are called to
I would then have them to memorize any particular passage that might deal with their sin in particular.
This is by no means exhaustive so do not stop here but it is a good start.
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James 1:21--the basis for the whole process
Romans 12:2 another base verse
Philippians 4:8 Control your thoughts
Romans 5:20 No matter how much I fail him he has more grace than I have sin
Psalms 32--David confesses his sin under inspiration of the Spirit and so we know this is a good passage to learn the heart of a forgiven one when he confesses.
Psalms 51 is the most obvious passage
Romans 6, 7, 8 this will take a long time but that is fine. As long as their heart and mind is consumed with the Scripture they will not be going back to sin. I think it was D L Moody that said that sin will keep you from the book or the book will keep you from sin.
Ephesians 4:17-31 Tells you what to replace your sin with
Colossians 3:1:17 Tells you how to live the new life you are called to
I would then have them to memorize any particular passage that might deal with their sin in particular.
This is by no means exhaustive so do not stop here but it is a good start.
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News of Victory
Sunday, October 14, 2007
Church Planting Intern
Here is Chris Gardner talking to the students of Pensacola about the possibility of being a church planting intern in Peru.
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News of Victory
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News of Victory
Friday, October 12, 2007
Thursday, October 11, 2007
Renewing our minds
I ask the people I work with who have fallen to memorize Scripture. We then get together regularly to discuss it. They not only memorize the Scripture but look up every word in the dictionary to see what it means. They meditate on how it applied to their circumstance etc. They will say these verses to me and discuss them with me so that I know that they are penetrating their hearts.
By the way--when they confessed their sin they resigned from all of their positions in the church but I did not have them make a public detailed confession of their sin. We do not want to glorify their sin nor do we want to have it published in Gath--I know you are wondering where that came from so check out this passage.
2Sa 1:20 Tell it not in Gath, publish it not in the streets of Askelon; lest the daughters of the Philistines rejoice, lest the daughters of the uncircumcised triumph.
The sin will need to confessed publicly if it was a public sin and can be confessed privately if it was a private sin I think. But there is no call to get the news out as much as you can because all you are doing is causing the lost world to rejoice in the failure of another of God's servants. Obviously I am not talking about someone who has committed a crime because then we would be bound to take it to the appropriate authorities. I am talking about the gossip factor that we so often seem to want to get caught up in.
If you spread it they will simply praise their false god.
Jdg 16:23 Then the lords of the Philistines gathered them together for to offer a great sacrifice unto Dagon their god, and to rejoice: for they said, Our god hath delivered Samson our enemy into our hand.
Jdg 16:24 And when the people saw him, they praised their god: for they said, Our god hath delivered into our hands our enemy, and the destroyer of our country, which slew many of us.
So he will resign voluntarily, Lord willing. There will be an appropriate confession but it is best to leave the public confession as generic as possible--after all our goal is not to embarrass our brother but to restore him.
Once he has written out his testimony, looked up all the verses that deal with his sin, and learned what to do not to follow the same path again we will being engrafting the word.
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By the way--when they confessed their sin they resigned from all of their positions in the church but I did not have them make a public detailed confession of their sin. We do not want to glorify their sin nor do we want to have it published in Gath--I know you are wondering where that came from so check out this passage.
2Sa 1:20 Tell it not in Gath, publish it not in the streets of Askelon; lest the daughters of the Philistines rejoice, lest the daughters of the uncircumcised triumph.
The sin will need to confessed publicly if it was a public sin and can be confessed privately if it was a private sin I think. But there is no call to get the news out as much as you can because all you are doing is causing the lost world to rejoice in the failure of another of God's servants. Obviously I am not talking about someone who has committed a crime because then we would be bound to take it to the appropriate authorities. I am talking about the gossip factor that we so often seem to want to get caught up in.
If you spread it they will simply praise their false god.
Jdg 16:23 Then the lords of the Philistines gathered them together for to offer a great sacrifice unto Dagon their god, and to rejoice: for they said, Our god hath delivered Samson our enemy into our hand.
Jdg 16:24 And when the people saw him, they praised their god: for they said, Our god hath delivered into our hands our enemy, and the destroyer of our country, which slew many of us.
So he will resign voluntarily, Lord willing. There will be an appropriate confession but it is best to leave the public confession as generic as possible--after all our goal is not to embarrass our brother but to restore him.
Once he has written out his testimony, looked up all the verses that deal with his sin, and learned what to do not to follow the same path again we will being engrafting the word.
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Wednesday, October 10, 2007
Actual steps to restoration
With all the background study in mind I think that you will understand what I consider to be the very important steps to restoration
1. The person needs to take the time to write out their testimony of failure in detail. Not to have a record of proof against them but rather to study and think about what caused or led to their failure. David did not fall into sin with Bathsheba in one swift move but rather there were a series of failures that we can clearly see that led to his failure.
If we know the steps that led to his failure we could as they say "nip it in the bud". When we see the steps that lead to failure we stop it long before it becomes a strong temptation.
That means what happened first, did he slack up on his Bible reading and prayer time? Did he hold some bitterness in his heart? What steps led him down the path of destruction?
2. I would have him go through the Bible and write down and study every verse that applies to his sin in particular. He needs the mind of God on his sin. What would the Bible say about what He has done. If he can see what God thinks about the particular sin maybe he can develop a hatred for the sin that will cause him not to fall into the same sin again.
3. Now we will begin the Bible study but before we do let me remind you that you will be expected to spend a great deal of time with this person. He needs love, comfort and friendship right now. He feels like a failure. He feels like no one loves or respects him now. You must practice "life on life" discipleship. It is more than a lesson it is a life. He must know that he has been received like the prodigal son was received when he returned home.
More next post--please feel free to post your opinions and questions and I will answer the appropriate ones.
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1. The person needs to take the time to write out their testimony of failure in detail. Not to have a record of proof against them but rather to study and think about what caused or led to their failure. David did not fall into sin with Bathsheba in one swift move but rather there were a series of failures that we can clearly see that led to his failure.
If we know the steps that led to his failure we could as they say "nip it in the bud". When we see the steps that lead to failure we stop it long before it becomes a strong temptation.
That means what happened first, did he slack up on his Bible reading and prayer time? Did he hold some bitterness in his heart? What steps led him down the path of destruction?
2. I would have him go through the Bible and write down and study every verse that applies to his sin in particular. He needs the mind of God on his sin. What would the Bible say about what He has done. If he can see what God thinks about the particular sin maybe he can develop a hatred for the sin that will cause him not to fall into the same sin again.
3. Now we will begin the Bible study but before we do let me remind you that you will be expected to spend a great deal of time with this person. He needs love, comfort and friendship right now. He feels like a failure. He feels like no one loves or respects him now. You must practice "life on life" discipleship. It is more than a lesson it is a life. He must know that he has been received like the prodigal son was received when he returned home.
More next post--please feel free to post your opinions and questions and I will answer the appropriate ones.
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Tuesday, October 09, 2007
Replacement 2
All of these posts are leading up to the real set of steps but I think that this background will help you to understand the way to go about really restoring someone to useful fulfilling service after getting the background and heart of the study.
Two of the passages of Scripture that we will have them learn and memorize will be included in this post but I want you to see once again the idea in the Scriptures of replacing your old ways with new ways.
I will only choose a few samplings of the verses so that you get the point and then we will move on to the steps of how to restore a man:
Eph 4:25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
Put away lying and speak truth is an example of the replacement. Our goal is not that he quit speaking but that he speak rightly.
Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
Better that he labor to give to others than that he steal to keep for himself. He has replaced the old way with a new way.
Rather than take the time to show you all of Colossians 3 suffice it to say that you will find the same truth repeated over and over in that chapter also. Put off, put on, Mortify, live.
We must help them have a reason to live. Every desire we have Satan would pervert from the original purpose that God has for it. We must have them think on these things-- what is right etc. Philippians 4:8
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Two of the passages of Scripture that we will have them learn and memorize will be included in this post but I want you to see once again the idea in the Scriptures of replacing your old ways with new ways.
I will only choose a few samplings of the verses so that you get the point and then we will move on to the steps of how to restore a man:
Eph 4:25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.
Put away lying and speak truth is an example of the replacement. Our goal is not that he quit speaking but that he speak rightly.
Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
Better that he labor to give to others than that he steal to keep for himself. He has replaced the old way with a new way.
Rather than take the time to show you all of Colossians 3 suffice it to say that you will find the same truth repeated over and over in that chapter also. Put off, put on, Mortify, live.
We must help them have a reason to live. Every desire we have Satan would pervert from the original purpose that God has for it. We must have them think on these things-- what is right etc. Philippians 4:8
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Monday, October 08, 2007
Replacement
If we get them to quit sinning and do not fill the void left from where the sin was they will very likely fall back into the sin again. Often we will pull away from one that is falling into sin and that will cause him to lose his godly friends and have no where to go when he decides to get right with God.
We have already been given plenty of instruction on what to do to avoid this problem.
Now consider what happens if you do not replace the sin with something right and holy.
Mat 12:43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.
We preach what we can't or shouldn't do and are known more for what we don't do than what we do and so we get him cleaned up but
Mat 12:44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished.
We gave temporary relief but did not give him a higher cause to live for and to. We got rid of the old spirit but did not replace it with the Holy Spirit. We got rid of the old thoughts but did not fill his heart and mind with the new thoughts.
Mat 12:45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.
How many times have we left them worse off after our help than they were before. Our harshness and yelling at them about their sin did not help. They needed rather to fill their heart with something that could make a difference. A new way of thinking and living--the Word of God.
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We have already been given plenty of instruction on what to do to avoid this problem.
Now consider what happens if you do not replace the sin with something right and holy.
Mat 12:43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.
We preach what we can't or shouldn't do and are known more for what we don't do than what we do and so we get him cleaned up but
Mat 12:44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished.
We gave temporary relief but did not give him a higher cause to live for and to. We got rid of the old spirit but did not replace it with the Holy Spirit. We got rid of the old thoughts but did not fill his heart and mind with the new thoughts.
Mat 12:45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.
How many times have we left them worse off after our help than they were before. Our harshness and yelling at them about their sin did not help. They needed rather to fill their heart with something that could make a difference. A new way of thinking and living--the Word of God.
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Friday, October 05, 2007
Steps to restoration
Once our brother has confessed his sin then we know that we must take steps to restore him or her. To restore someone I think that we need to learn several basic truths about the spiritual life.
It is the word of God that can save us or change and transform us so we will want to work at getting the word of God into their hearts.
Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
Notice that the first step is the confessing and forsaking of sin. Once confessed and forsaken if we do not take some definite steps it will only be a matter of time before the believer falls into the same sin.
He must receive the word with meekness or humility. He must engraft it into his heart, mind and life.
The word of God in his life will totally change him.
They need to be transformed by the renewing of their minds which takes place by us filling our minds and hearts with the word of God
Rom 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Eph 5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
Eph 5:27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
The way we clean up the church and God's people is through the application of the word of God. I am not sure that this makes sense to you but to me it is not optional.
I am a strong believer in the memorization and meditation on the word of God and that through this it will change our lives.
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It is the word of God that can save us or change and transform us so we will want to work at getting the word of God into their hearts.
Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
Notice that the first step is the confessing and forsaking of sin. Once confessed and forsaken if we do not take some definite steps it will only be a matter of time before the believer falls into the same sin.
He must receive the word with meekness or humility. He must engraft it into his heart, mind and life.
The word of God in his life will totally change him.
They need to be transformed by the renewing of their minds which takes place by us filling our minds and hearts with the word of God
Rom 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Eph 5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
Eph 5:27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
The way we clean up the church and God's people is through the application of the word of God. I am not sure that this makes sense to you but to me it is not optional.
I am a strong believer in the memorization and meditation on the word of God and that through this it will change our lives.
Vision News
Thursday, October 04, 2007
Consider yourself
Just remember when dealing with anyone about their sin that you would be wise to consider yourself and to treat your brother like you would like to be treated if it were you. He is not the only one that is going to fall into sin.
Pro 24:16 For a just man falleth seven times, and riseth up again: but the wicked shall fall into mischief.
It is easy to see the sin in my brother's life and desire to punish him but it is not God's will. I must remember that I might fall and though I haven't fallen in the same sin or to the same extent I must remember that I could fall also.
Pro 24:17 Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, and let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth:
We are not to rejoice when our enemy falls much less when our brother falls. I am afraid that so many of us are desiring to stand by and say if he had done what I said then he wouldn't have fallen. We must be careful to not almost get happy to see someone fall into sin.
The first that most clearly teaches this truth is
Gal 6:1 Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.
Ye which are spiritual restore! Do we? Notice that we are to consider ourself lest we be tempted. It will happen sooner or later. The forgiven forgive.
I wanted to set the ground rules before we started into our discussion of how to deal with a brother that has fallen.
There are to be several witnesses.
We do not believe gossip.
We consider ourselves and the way that we would want to be treated.
We seek to restore them
We will forgive, comfort and confirm our love to them once they get right.
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Pro 24:16 For a just man falleth seven times, and riseth up again: but the wicked shall fall into mischief.
It is easy to see the sin in my brother's life and desire to punish him but it is not God's will. I must remember that I might fall and though I haven't fallen in the same sin or to the same extent I must remember that I could fall also.
Pro 24:17 Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, and let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth:
We are not to rejoice when our enemy falls much less when our brother falls. I am afraid that so many of us are desiring to stand by and say if he had done what I said then he wouldn't have fallen. We must be careful to not almost get happy to see someone fall into sin.
The first that most clearly teaches this truth is
Gal 6:1 Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.
Ye which are spiritual restore! Do we? Notice that we are to consider ourself lest we be tempted. It will happen sooner or later. The forgiven forgive.
I wanted to set the ground rules before we started into our discussion of how to deal with a brother that has fallen.
There are to be several witnesses.
We do not believe gossip.
We consider ourselves and the way that we would want to be treated.
We seek to restore them
We will forgive, comfort and confirm our love to them once they get right.
Vision News
Wednesday, October 03, 2007
Restoration is the goal
Please remember at all times that restoration is our goal and we are never desirous of punishing our brother. That is the work of God.
First mention of church discipline shows that the goal is to be restoration.
Mat 18:15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
Mat 18:16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
Mat 18:17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.
The real goal was never to kick someone out of the church though that has often become the perspective today. Our goal is to see our brother serve God with all of his heart.
The following passage speaks of a brother that has been disciplined by the church and I believe it may be the man from I Corinthians 5 who was found in a horrible sin of incest. But notice that the desire was to see him get back into fellowship. I have highlighted several words that I think are very important.
2Co 2:6 Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, which was inflicted of many.
He had not gotten right until it escalated to the point that the whole church was involved. That would not eat with him or fellowship with him. They had prayed that God would turn him over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh. I Corinthians 5
2Co 2:7 So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him, and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one should be swallowed up with overmuch sorrow.
Now they are told to forgive him and to comfort him lest he be swallowed up of overmuch sorrow. That has happened to many of our members and friends. We have been so harsh that they are lost to other churches or even the world. They realized their sin but found no forgiveness or comfort from the church and their brothers.
2Co 2:8 Wherefore I beseech you that ye would confirm your love toward him.
Paul said that they now needed to confirm their love to him. He has confessed and forsaken his sin. He needs to know that he is forgiven and that you have comforted him that fell into sin but more than that you must make sure he knows that he is loved. Confirm your love to him.
2Co 2:9 For to this end also did I write, that I might know the proof of you, whether ye be obedient in all things.
Paul didn't leave it as optional but rather said that it was something he was commanding them to do-they were to be obedient. They were to prove that they would follow his leadership.
2Co 2:10 To whom ye forgive any thing, I forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person of Christ;
2Co 2:11 Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices.
The biggest key is that Satan will get an advantage if we are not careful. We can be too hard on sin and have often been too hard. Sin must be dealt with but we must not have the attitude of hurting our brother.
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First mention of church discipline shows that the goal is to be restoration.
Mat 18:15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
Mat 18:16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
Mat 18:17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.
The real goal was never to kick someone out of the church though that has often become the perspective today. Our goal is to see our brother serve God with all of his heart.
The following passage speaks of a brother that has been disciplined by the church and I believe it may be the man from I Corinthians 5 who was found in a horrible sin of incest. But notice that the desire was to see him get back into fellowship. I have highlighted several words that I think are very important.
2Co 2:6 Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, which was inflicted of many.
He had not gotten right until it escalated to the point that the whole church was involved. That would not eat with him or fellowship with him. They had prayed that God would turn him over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh. I Corinthians 5
2Co 2:7 So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him, and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one should be swallowed up with overmuch sorrow.
Now they are told to forgive him and to comfort him lest he be swallowed up of overmuch sorrow. That has happened to many of our members and friends. We have been so harsh that they are lost to other churches or even the world. They realized their sin but found no forgiveness or comfort from the church and their brothers.
2Co 2:8 Wherefore I beseech you that ye would confirm your love toward him.
Paul said that they now needed to confirm their love to him. He has confessed and forsaken his sin. He needs to know that he is forgiven and that you have comforted him that fell into sin but more than that you must make sure he knows that he is loved. Confirm your love to him.
2Co 2:9 For to this end also did I write, that I might know the proof of you, whether ye be obedient in all things.
Paul didn't leave it as optional but rather said that it was something he was commanding them to do-they were to be obedient. They were to prove that they would follow his leadership.
2Co 2:10 To whom ye forgive any thing, I forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person of Christ;
2Co 2:11 Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices.
The biggest key is that Satan will get an advantage if we are not careful. We can be too hard on sin and have often been too hard. Sin must be dealt with but we must not have the attitude of hurting our brother.
Vision News
Tuesday, October 02, 2007
The Summit
One of the most exciting missionaries in the world today is a friend of ours that works in Northern Africa. He and his wife are learning Arabic. They are living in hostile circumstances, with intense pressure from Muslims to convert to Islam. Rather than get converted to Christ the Muslims are trying to convert the missionaries.
Their son has been know to wake up in his bed at 4:30 AM when he hears the call to prayer and cry and be afraid of what they are trying to do to him.
It is a beautiful country and they are beautiful people but without a doubt this young couple are living what only the missionary heroes of the past have lived.
They have seen people saved. They have been involved in preaching and teaching the people about Jesus. It is against the law yet they boldly proclaim the name of Jesus. They are heroes and you will get your chance to not only meet them and get to talk to them but you can ask questions and learn what it is like to go behind the closed doors of Muslim countries.
I want to invite you to go to their blogs and read stories that will thrill you and your family for the honor and glory of Christ. His blog is Ramblings in North Africa!. Her blog is Lady Ramblings.
You can get more information about the summit by clicking here.
Click around on the page and learn all that you can. Plan to be with us. We will have a wonderful time in Gatlinburg and Pigeon Forge but more than that you will spend time with God’s heroes.
Vision News
Their son has been know to wake up in his bed at 4:30 AM when he hears the call to prayer and cry and be afraid of what they are trying to do to him.
It is a beautiful country and they are beautiful people but without a doubt this young couple are living what only the missionary heroes of the past have lived.
They have seen people saved. They have been involved in preaching and teaching the people about Jesus. It is against the law yet they boldly proclaim the name of Jesus. They are heroes and you will get your chance to not only meet them and get to talk to them but you can ask questions and learn what it is like to go behind the closed doors of Muslim countries.
I want to invite you to go to their blogs and read stories that will thrill you and your family for the honor and glory of Christ. His blog is Ramblings in North Africa!. Her blog is Lady Ramblings.
You can get more information about the summit by clicking here.
Click around on the page and learn all that you can. Plan to be with us. We will have a wonderful time in Gatlinburg and Pigeon Forge but more than that you will spend time with God’s heroes.
Vision News
Be sure to get involved in the discussion
ON the post that begins this current discussion you will find a comment and my answer. I would like to ask you to get involved as soon as you can and ask questions or lend an ear.
The comments will have good information in them to I am sure.
Click here to go to the start of the discussion and then click on the word comments and you can read them and my responses.
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The comments will have good information in them to I am sure.
Click here to go to the start of the discussion and then click on the word comments and you can read them and my responses.
Vision News
questions and comments please
Well I just finished the next two weeks of posts for this blog on this very important subject. I want to invite you to ask questions and make comments. I will do my best to answer any that I can.
I truly love people and want to help them. This is the plan that we followed in Peru.
This is in my opinion true Church Discipline. If possible you want to take care of it long before it gets to the church and to gain our brother. If it can not be taken care of before then that will just be a painful procedure that we are bound to follow but.
Let's go love our people and see what we can do to help them.
If you think that you might like to follow this discussion and get it in your email be sure and click on the following link:
Subscribe to World Evangelism by Email
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I truly love people and want to help them. This is the plan that we followed in Peru.
This is in my opinion true Church Discipline. If possible you want to take care of it long before it gets to the church and to gain our brother. If it can not be taken care of before then that will just be a painful procedure that we are bound to follow but.
Let's go love our people and see what we can do to help them.
If you think that you might like to follow this discussion and get it in your email be sure and click on the following link:
Subscribe to World Evangelism by Email
Vision News
Biblical plan for restoration
I would like to share some ideas about how to deal with sin and failure in the lives of our church members and especially leadership that might at least give you something to think about.
This is assuming that the person that you are dealing with has acknowledged their sin and desires to get right with God. I do think that I will start with what I would do along the way to even get them to that point.
1. First do not believe what people tell you about another preacher, leader, or Christian. You will soon find out that it is easy to accuse another brother and we were instructed to not receive an accusation against a brother without witnesses
1Ti 5:19 Against an elder receive not an accusation, but before two or three witnesses.
That not only applies to elders, pastors, or leaders but to all people:
Deu 17:6 At the mouth of two witnesses, or three witnesses, shall he that is worthy of death be put to death; but at the mouth of one witness he shall not be put to death.
Deu 19:15 One witness shall not rise up against a man for any iniquity, or for any sin, in any sin that he sinneth: at the mouth of two witnesses, or at the mouth of three witnesses, shall the matter be established.
Remember that there can be false witnesses also.
Deu 19:18 And the judges shall make diligent inquisition: and, behold, if the witness be a false witness, and hath testified falsely against his brother;
Deu 19:19 Then shall ye do unto him, as he had thought to have done unto his brother: so shalt thou put the evil away from among you.
Step one is to be sure that you have really investigated to find out if the brother is guilty.
I suggest that rather than accusing or seeming that you want to harm your brother that you go to him and that you ask him what he has to say about the accusations that you have heard. The conversation would be as kind and as pleasant as it could be because our goal is to always restore our brother.
Ask him like this; I have heard some things that concern me and I wanted to ask you to help me understand and know the truth about this things.
If he denies it then you probe further and further until you have an idea about the truth.
If he does not confess and you do have witnesses then you will have to bring them out but it would be much better if the Holy Spirit would convict him and cause him to recognize his sin and to get it right as soon as possible.
Vision News
This is assuming that the person that you are dealing with has acknowledged their sin and desires to get right with God. I do think that I will start with what I would do along the way to even get them to that point.
1. First do not believe what people tell you about another preacher, leader, or Christian. You will soon find out that it is easy to accuse another brother and we were instructed to not receive an accusation against a brother without witnesses
1Ti 5:19 Against an elder receive not an accusation, but before two or three witnesses.
That not only applies to elders, pastors, or leaders but to all people:
Deu 17:6 At the mouth of two witnesses, or three witnesses, shall he that is worthy of death be put to death; but at the mouth of one witness he shall not be put to death.
Deu 19:15 One witness shall not rise up against a man for any iniquity, or for any sin, in any sin that he sinneth: at the mouth of two witnesses, or at the mouth of three witnesses, shall the matter be established.
Remember that there can be false witnesses also.
Deu 19:18 And the judges shall make diligent inquisition: and, behold, if the witness be a false witness, and hath testified falsely against his brother;
Deu 19:19 Then shall ye do unto him, as he had thought to have done unto his brother: so shalt thou put the evil away from among you.
Step one is to be sure that you have really investigated to find out if the brother is guilty.
I suggest that rather than accusing or seeming that you want to harm your brother that you go to him and that you ask him what he has to say about the accusations that you have heard. The conversation would be as kind and as pleasant as it could be because our goal is to always restore our brother.
Ask him like this; I have heard some things that concern me and I wanted to ask you to help me understand and know the truth about this things.
If he denies it then you probe further and further until you have an idea about the truth.
If he does not confess and you do have witnesses then you will have to bring them out but it would be much better if the Holy Spirit would convict him and cause him to recognize his sin and to get it right as soon as possible.
Vision News
Monday, October 01, 2007
Amusing the crowds!
'I fear there are some who preach with the view of amusing men, and as long as people can be gathered in crowds, and their ears can be tickled, and they can retire pleased with what they have heard, the orator is content, and folds his hands, and goes back self-satisfied. But Paul did not lay himself out to please the public and collect the crowd. If he did not save them he felt that it was of no avail to interest them. Unless the truth had pierced their hearts, affected their lives, and made new men of them, Paul would have gone home crying, "Who hath believed our report, and to whom is the arm of the Lord revealed?"...
Now observe, brethren, if I, or you, or any of us, or all of us, shall have spent our lives merely in amusing men, or educating men, or moralizing men, when we shall come to give our account at the last great day we shall be in a very sorry condition, and we shall have but a very sorry record to render; for of what avail will it be to a man to be educated when he comes to be damned? Of what service will it be to him to have been amused when the trumpet sounds, and heaven and earth are shaking, and the pit opens wide her jaws of fire and swallows up the soul unsaved? Of what avail even to have moralized a man if still he is on the left hand of the judge, and if still, "Depart, ye cursed," shall be his portion?'" ["Soul Saving Our One Business," The Metropolitan Tabernacle Pulpit, Vol. 25 (London: Passmore and Alabaster, 1879), 674-76.]
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Now observe, brethren, if I, or you, or any of us, or all of us, shall have spent our lives merely in amusing men, or educating men, or moralizing men, when we shall come to give our account at the last great day we shall be in a very sorry condition, and we shall have but a very sorry record to render; for of what avail will it be to a man to be educated when he comes to be damned? Of what service will it be to him to have been amused when the trumpet sounds, and heaven and earth are shaking, and the pit opens wide her jaws of fire and swallows up the soul unsaved? Of what avail even to have moralized a man if still he is on the left hand of the judge, and if still, "Depart, ye cursed," shall be his portion?'" ["Soul Saving Our One Business," The Metropolitan Tabernacle Pulpit, Vol. 25 (London: Passmore and Alabaster, 1879), 674-76.]
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